Tapeheads Forums


Go Back   Tapeheads Forums > Tape, Taping and Tape Machines > Reel To Reel

Reel To Reel All discussions pertaining to reel to reel decks including general usage, recording, playback, servicing tips and blank tape.

Universal Capstan Motor
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-14-2013, 09:15 AM
manofmint's Avatar
manofmint manofmint is offline
TapeHeads.Net Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 65
teac a-4300sx or pioneer rt 707

looking at these two units...
what do the pros recommend when picking between these two?
thanks
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 04-14-2013, 12:04 PM
Eminence1963's Avatar
Eminence1963 Eminence1963 is offline
DCC Lives On
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Washington
Posts: 1,663
Quote:
Originally Posted by manofmint View Post
looking at these two units...
what do the pros recommend when picking between these two?
thanks
Hands down Pioneer....... IMO
707 has the pause switch and variable pitch control.
I cant understand why the pause switch is omitted, on certain machines. This is a must have function for me.
As usual my 2 cents. Others will chime in on there opinions too.
This unit has the pause switch though as I was looking at another deck sheese!!!!!
Still think Pioneer newer looking
__________________
N K A W T G USAF Retired

Last edited by Eminence1963; 04-14-2013 at 12:09 PM. Reason: looked at wrong deck this one has the pause switch
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-14-2013, 03:13 PM
Bandwidth's Avatar
Bandwidth Bandwidth is offline
RTR FREAK and Tapeheads Supporter
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Northern New Jersey
Posts: 2,505
Every other day there is a thread started about deck XXXX vs. Pioneer RT-7XX.

Just cut to the chase.

I think that the Pioneer is the BEST, all-around 7" machine ever made!

With the Teac A-2300XX a close runner up.
__________________
RTR: SWEET 19

CASS: 1/2 DZ
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-14-2013, 04:29 PM
asc1000 asc1000 is offline
TapeHeads.Net Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Midwest, USA
Posts: 25
Pros wouldn't buy either one...

Professionals have requirements that neither of those machines could satisfy. But amateur enthusiasts, on the other hand, will have lots to say.

Here's my take.

RT-70x Pros:

- Stunning looks
- Compact size
- Pitch control

RT-70x Cons:

- Parts availability
- Softer heads that wear faster
- Output control is on the back

A-4300SX Pros:

- Parts availability
- Front panel output control
- Meter high/normal range switch

A-4300SX Cons:

- Big for a 7"
- Dated looking
- No pitch control

Can't really go too wrong with either. Pick the one you like.

Amardeep

Last edited by asc1000; 04-14-2013 at 07:53 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-14-2013, 04:53 PM
dey93254's Avatar
dey93254 dey93254 is offline
oldsckool
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: new cuyama ca
Posts: 2,045
I own a 707 and it is quite nice. I like the fact that it will do reverse play in both directions thus keeping a tape going for hours. Recording at 3.75 ips is quite good so a 2400 foot tape of mixed songs will play for 4 hours and then start again if you wish without the re-threading of tape. and it is rack mountable.

Thomas
__________________
Tapeheads Supporter
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-14-2013, 05:09 PM
Tympani's Avatar
Tympani Tympani is offline
Serious Tapehead
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 186
I have a RT-707 and a A-4300 (not SX). I got the RT-707 first then within 3 years purchased the A-4300. To me, the A-4300 sounds a lot better than the RT-707. The tape transport is better too. I boghut the RT-707 because of its look. I was disappointed by its sound and have regretted it all these years. My Akai GX-4000D sounds a lot better than the RT-707 too despite it is a low end deck.

Last edited by Tympani; 04-14-2013 at 05:11 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-14-2013, 05:16 PM
ggoat!!! ggoat!!! is offline
Invented NuFinish SSS Fix
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 523
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tympani View Post
I got the RT-707...I was disappointed by its sound and have regretted it all these years. My Akai GX-4000D sounds a lot better than the RT-707 too despite it is a low end deck.
Something is DEFINITELY wrong with your RT-707.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 04-14-2013, 05:23 PM
ggoat!!! ggoat!!! is offline
Invented NuFinish SSS Fix
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 523
Quote:
Originally Posted by asc1000 View Post

RT-70x Cons:

- Motors tend to need rebuilding
- Output control is on the back
- Pinch rollers frequently turn to goo

Amardeep

I have over 20 Pioneer RT-707 and 701 decks. I've never had to rebuild a motor in ANY of them, and one of them is used as a workhorse ONLY for cleaning and Nu-Finishing tapes. It is basically used as a winding machine. A lot of drag is put on those motors when using them merely as a transport to spin reels while dragging them down with a cloth on the tapes, especially when the tapes are sticky. That deck, as well as ALL others, have NEVER had a motor issue. This is not any sort of common problem with the RT-707 or 701 decks

Output control being on the back is a non-issue...set it once and forget it. I prefer the 701 since it doesn't have output controls, and thus has two less pots to get scratchy.

Pinch rollers on the RT-707 and 701 don't turn to goo. You are confusing them with the RT-909 and 901 decks, which DO turn to goo. They are not the same as on the 707/701. There is only one rubber pinch roller on the RT-707/701. The left-most roller on the 707/701 is a metal roller.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 04-14-2013, 06:15 PM
Skywavebe's Avatar
Skywavebe Skywavebe is offline
Skywave Tape Deck Repair
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Bensenville, IL
Posts: 5,851
As most of you know I am a Teac man as that is where I based most of my repair experience. But I have worked on a couple dozen Pioneer decks too as of late. I have not had a RT-707 in my shop yet but if I remember looking it up- the capstan is a direct drive motor. You can't beat that no matter who is using it. Therefore just on that basis alone I have to say the RT-707 is the one to get. The comment on the heads of the Pioneer decks, I have seen where they last as long as if not longer than the Teac Canon heads.
I will not say they are soft or in any way deficient. If I was spending the same money for both decks and the Teac A4300SX had new heads on it and the Pioneer worn head that would make me pick the Teac over the Pioneer but with equal wear on each head stack- I have to say the Pioneer edges out the Teac by a little bit.
Pinch Rollers go soft on any deck I have seen Studers included. It is just a reality of age and that is about it. We have Terry to rebuild them so that is always the option. I have had many done from his service and they were always 100%. Now price wise that can sway you as well as the bad single pinch roller on a A4300SX or a dual Pinch Roller rebuild on the Pioneer will be twice the price if the roller are sticky. I guess I would also weigh in the decision by head wear as well as Roller condition. The Teac will eventually need a couple of belts- the Pioneer not.
__________________
Best regards,

Sam Palermo, BSEE
Skywave Tape Deck Repair- Chicago area
(630)616-0932 Office/ 708-334-2260 Cell, skywavebe@sbcglobal.net
Past Teac/Tascam Lead Service Technician at Chicago Factory Service still doing repairs.
http://www.thumbtack.com/il/bensenvi...tascam-repairs
Need Tape? http://www.splicit.com/index.html
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-14-2013, 07:28 PM
asc1000 asc1000 is offline
TapeHeads.Net Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Midwest, USA
Posts: 25
I sit corrected.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ggoat!!! View Post
Pinch rollers on the RT-707 and 701 don't turn to goo. You are confusing them with the RT-909 and 901 decks, which DO turn to goo. They are not the same as on the 707/701. There is only one rubber pinch roller on the RT-707/701. The left-most roller on the 707/701 is a metal roller.
Yes, I was thinking of the RT-90x. A year ago I was researching it for possible purchase. I found unit after unit with deteriorated pinch rollers... it was more than a trend. I also found a DVD video made by a tech on rebuilding 909's in which he emphasized the need to refurb the reel motors on many of those machines. As a result of all that I steered away from Pioneer. Perhaps I need to give the 700 series another look, especially with Sam's endorsement.

Amardeep

Last edited by asc1000; 04-14-2013 at 08:00 PM. Reason: Extend remarks.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 04-14-2013, 08:18 PM
Eminence1963's Avatar
Eminence1963 Eminence1963 is offline
DCC Lives On
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Washington
Posts: 1,663
Just to clarify there is only one rubber pinch roller on the Pioneer 701/707 series deck.
__________________
N K A W T G USAF Retired
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 04-15-2013, 06:07 AM
Bandwidth's Avatar
Bandwidth Bandwidth is offline
RTR FREAK and Tapeheads Supporter
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Northern New Jersey
Posts: 2,505
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eminence1963 View Post
Just to clarify there is only one rubber pinch roller on the Pioneer 701/707 series deck.
That is correct - it is on the take-up side. The one on the supply side is NOT rubber. Can be easily distinguished by its "shiny" appearance.
__________________
RTR: SWEET 19

CASS: 1/2 DZ
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 04-15-2013, 06:17 AM
dutch_frank dutch_frank is offline
Serious Tapehead
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 428
I still have an A-4300SX and I used to have a Pioner RT-707. I prefer the looks of the A-4300SX over the RT-707. IMHO the RT-707 is much too small for an open reel deck. However, its weight says enough...
The capstan motor of the RT-707 is really huge. Many A-4300SX decks suffer from tape wandering away problems so for that reason I should take an RT-707 if I had to choose between those two. If it was for the looks I would surely go for the A-4300SX. The quality of both decks should be about equal. Perhaps the RT-707 sounds a bit better but I haven't compared them side by side. On many forums I read the RT-707 is the ultimate 4 track consumer tapedeck when it comes to hifi sound reproduction.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 04-15-2013, 06:25 AM
Skywavebe's Avatar
Skywavebe Skywavebe is offline
Skywave Tape Deck Repair
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Bensenville, IL
Posts: 5,851
OK a singe Pinch Roller it is. I was going on the memory of the 901 and 909 I had here. Why would a guy say that AC reel motors in the Pioneer decks needs rebuilding- that is ridiculous. I have to say that the AC reel motors in any good deck have never had to be rebuilt although Pioneer does a lot more with them than Teac does control wise- this is what leads me to think that Pioneer controlling the Torque on AC motors had some designers that knew what they were doing. Imagine an X1000 with AC controlled reel motors- you would never have trouble with them. Also the dual capstan system that the RT 909 uses is better controlled as there are guides next to the Pinch rollers that insure that skew- a major issue with the Teac designs, are avoided. Don't tell me that a large company like Pioneer had Engineers that were not on the ball- I think they we very well established and as can be found now to be some smart fellows. I wish they would have put an AC motor in for the capstan though.
__________________
Best regards,

Sam Palermo, BSEE
Skywave Tape Deck Repair- Chicago area
(630)616-0932 Office/ 708-334-2260 Cell, skywavebe@sbcglobal.net
Past Teac/Tascam Lead Service Technician at Chicago Factory Service still doing repairs.
http://www.thumbtack.com/il/bensenvi...tascam-repairs
Need Tape? http://www.splicit.com/index.html
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 04-15-2013, 06:42 AM
pioneercollector's Avatar
pioneercollector pioneercollector is offline
Serious Tapehead
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,725
Quote:
Originally Posted by ggoat!!! View Post
Something is DEFINITELY wrong with your RT-707.
As per GGOATS comments - The one you heard must be dying, mine has always sounding excellent for what it is - My first R2R was a very used RT707, i purchased it around 9 years ago, use it weekly - And it has never let me down....in any way I also have a nice reconditioned RT 909 (The RT 707 was certainly not reconditioned!) and it is a beautiful looking unit, one of the prettiest around (IMHO), But it can be fickle sometimes, more attention seeking than the 707 - But i wouldn't part with either of them....ever - In fact i am looking for a second 707 at the moment, Because i love 'em But i am biased
__________________
Whenever I fill out an application, in the part that says, 'In case of emergency, notify:' I put 'DOCTOR.'

TAPEHEADS SUPPORTER

Pioneer SA9800, SG9800,CT-1250(Rescued by A.N.T!),CT-950,RT-707, RT909, SR303 RG2, TX-D1000, P-D70, P-D7700, Technics 1600 MK2, Mission Argonaut MK2,Yamaha NS10m, Aiwa XK-S9000(A.N.T Modified) Nakamichi 681zx,Akai 57 DX, Nakamichi ZX7,Studer A721, Revox b790,Aiwa AP2600, Aiwa AD6800, Akai GX95 MK2....New Arrival NOS Pioneer CT-1050 amongst other stuff!
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 04-15-2013, 09:33 AM
asc1000 asc1000 is offline
TapeHeads.Net Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Midwest, USA
Posts: 25
Repair Video

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skywavebe View Post
Why would a guy say that AC reel motors in the Pioneer decks needs rebuilding- that is ridiculous.
I'll try to find the youtube excerpt I saw from his DVD. It was a while ago and my memory isn't real clear on exactly what he said. But he sure put the scare into me. I steered well clear of Pioneer products after that. If I locate it I'll post the link.

Amardeep
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 04-15-2013, 10:47 AM
Bandwidth's Avatar
Bandwidth Bandwidth is offline
RTR FREAK and Tapeheads Supporter
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Northern New Jersey
Posts: 2,505
Quote:
Originally Posted by asc1000 View Post
I'll try to find the youtube excerpt I saw from his DVD. It was a while ago and my memory isn't real clear on exactly what he said. But he sure put the scare into me. I steered well clear of Pioneer products after that. If I locate it I'll post the link.

Amardeep
That's like saying, gee I know somebody who blew a Pirelli tire - scared me off from them....

C'mon!
__________________
RTR: SWEET 19

CASS: 1/2 DZ
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 04-15-2013, 02:04 PM
asc1000 asc1000 is offline
TapeHeads.Net Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Midwest, USA
Posts: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bandwidth View Post
That's like saying, gee I know somebody who blew a Pirelli tire - scared me off from them....

C'mon!
More precisely it's like saying "A service shop told me they see lots of blown out Pirelli tires." It happened with Firestone, actually. You're certainly entitled to go buy a car with circa 2000 Firestones on it and drive yourself into a frenzy. Most people never had a problem.

Until I find the video again it will be hard to confirm his exact statement (or my admittedly imperfect interpretation of it) so it's best to treat it as inadmissible evidence. That is why I removed it from my list of cons.

Amardeep
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 04-15-2013, 07:39 PM
asc1000 asc1000 is offline
TapeHeads.Net Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Midwest, USA
Posts: 25
Found the guy's video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3VjX-OGbuc

At 4:37 he's tearing down what might be the RT-909 capstan motor. It looks like a DC brush motor with significant carbon fouling. So my recollection was faulty in that it wasn't the AC reel motors. DC motors do have higher service requirements than AC motors due to the arcing wear on the brushes and commutator contacts. Their life is impacted by number of starts as well as load and total hours of operation.

According to HiFiEngine the RT-707 uses an AC servo capstan motor. If that is correct and all three motors are AC, it should be a very long life piece of equipment.

Amardeep

Last edited by asc1000; 04-16-2013 at 08:48 PM. Reason: Fixed typing error.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 04-15-2013, 08:24 PM
Eminence1963's Avatar
Eminence1963 Eminence1963 is offline
DCC Lives On
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Washington
Posts: 1,663
Quote:
Originally Posted by asc1000 View Post
According to HiFiEngine the RT-707 uses an AC server capstan motor. If that is correct and all three motors are AC, it should be a very long life piece of equipment.

Amardeep
That is correct all 3 motors are AC
__________________
N K A W T G USAF Retired
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
teac A-4300SX History? theoman Reel To Reel 19 05-28-2013 03:45 PM
Does the Teac A-4300SX record in reverse? thane Reel To Reel 3 03-14-2012 02:01 PM
Teac 4300 & 4300SX gettinclose Reel To Reel 2 06-01-2010 01:21 PM



For more Tapeheads affiliates and links, see the Links and Resources page.
Would you like to see your company or site here?  CONTACT US


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:11 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2013, Tapeheads.Net. All rights reserved, no use of any element incorporated into this site without express written permission.