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Old 03-27-2012, 07:28 AM
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daveyh daveyh is offline
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Teac 3440 problems need help

I have a Teac 3440 and there is no output in channels 1 and 2. The meters work and there in signal but no output. Channels 3 and 4 are fine. I have tried to change the boards around and it did not help. I tried a TEAC Tone generator and I am getting signal to the meters but no output in channels 1 and 2. I replaced the lamps with 8V 100mA ended wire lamps but I can not remember if I checked all for channels for output before I replaced them. Does anybody have any idea as to what might be wrong? All meters and lamps work. Just no sound coming out of the monitor headphone jack for 1 and 2 or RCA connections. I have cleaned all the switches. Still nothing.
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Old 03-27-2012, 07:32 AM
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Skywavebe Skywavebe is online now
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This problem can be due to dBx jumpers in the rear either being pushed in too far as they short- the metal ones, or the deck has no jumpers in the rear for those channels while you were testing- make sure a dBx or the jumpers are there and then test again. If the card swap does not change conditions then you are either looking at jumpers missing or a motherboard problem.
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Sam Palermo, BSEE, past Broadcast Engineer
Skywave Tape Deck Repair- Chicago area
(630)616-0932 Office/ 708-334-2260 Cell, E mail:skywavebe@sbcglobal.net
Past Teac/Tascam Lead Service Technician at Chicago Factory Service still doing repairs.
http://www.thumbtack.com/il/bensenvi...tascam-repairs
Need Tape? http://www.splicit.com/index.html, The BEST SM are from Stereomanuals.com!
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  #3  
Old 03-27-2012, 07:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skywavebe View Post
This problem can be due to dBx jumpers in the rear either being pushed in too far as they short- the metal ones, or the deck has no jumpers in the rear for those channels while you were testing- make sure a dBx or the jumpers are there and then test again. If the card swap does not change conditions then you are either looking at jumpers missing or a motherboard problem.
Thanks. I have tried to re-seat the jumpers in back on both the DBX and Encoder inputs. All are present. It did not help.
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Old 03-27-2012, 07:56 AM
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Skywavebe Skywavebe is online now
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OK,
It then seems like you need to trace out the signal loss from start to where it stops and then take remedial action. I am in the Chicago area and am very active in the repair of these decks. In the even that you are in a different state and you do not want to get into the nitty gritty of the deck, I may be able to suggest other repair people to help you on this repair.
In the past I have seen motherboard connection issues and once in a while a pin bent over from the card connectors- you need to be careful when inserting the cards- take a flash light and make sure the connector pins are straight- one could be missing the socket and it can be just that.
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Best regards,

Sam Palermo, BSEE, past Broadcast Engineer
Skywave Tape Deck Repair- Chicago area
(630)616-0932 Office/ 708-334-2260 Cell, E mail:skywavebe@sbcglobal.net
Past Teac/Tascam Lead Service Technician at Chicago Factory Service still doing repairs.
http://www.thumbtack.com/il/bensenvi...tascam-repairs
Need Tape? http://www.splicit.com/index.html, The BEST SM are from Stereomanuals.com!
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  #5  
Old 03-27-2012, 09:42 AM
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daveyh daveyh is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skywavebe View Post
OK,
It then seems like you need to trace out the signal loss from start to where it stops and then take remedial action. I am in the Chicago area and am very active in the repair of these decks. In the even that you are in a different state and you do not want to get into the nitty gritty of the deck, I may be able to suggest other repair people to help you on this repair.
In the past I have seen motherboard connection issues and once in a while a pin bent over from the card connectors- you need to be careful when inserting the cards- take a flash light and make sure the connector pins are straight- one could be missing the socket and it can be just that.
Checked the boards for bent or missing pins. Everything is plugged in correctly and no loose connections. I have no way of tracing this myself so I guess I will have to take it in to someone who knows more about it than myself. I have someone in mind but I thought I could find out the problem by some posting.

If you can think of anything else to look for please to post it.
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Old 03-27-2012, 11:17 AM
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Skywavebe Skywavebe is online now
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Well, make sure the heads are clean and that the tape rides correctly on the gaps as in tape to head contact is a must. As Leon is fond of saying many repairs become simple after the head are properly cleaned. If the heads have black spots along the gap area that can not be cleaned off then it might be time for new heads. Can you send a picture of the heads?
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Best regards,

Sam Palermo, BSEE, past Broadcast Engineer
Skywave Tape Deck Repair- Chicago area
(630)616-0932 Office/ 708-334-2260 Cell, E mail:skywavebe@sbcglobal.net
Past Teac/Tascam Lead Service Technician at Chicago Factory Service still doing repairs.
http://www.thumbtack.com/il/bensenvi...tascam-repairs
Need Tape? http://www.splicit.com/index.html, The BEST SM are from Stereomanuals.com!
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  #7  
Old 03-27-2012, 11:35 AM
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daveyh daveyh is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skywavebe View Post
Well, make sure the heads are clean and that the tape rides correctly on the gaps as in tape to head contact is a must. As Leon is fond of saying many repairs become simple after the head are properly cleaned. If the heads have black spots along the gap area that can not be cleaned off then it might be time for new heads. Can you send a picture of the heads?
I think the heads are fine but here is a picture. What do you think?
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File Type: jpg teac_heads.jpg (45.0 KB, 24 views)
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  #8  
Old 03-27-2012, 12:20 PM
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tapetech tapetech is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daveyh View Post
I am getting signal to the meters but no output in channels 1 and 2.
If the meters are working in play as you say, then you may have a muting problem. Remove muting transistor Q109 and see if that restores play output.

Heads look good.
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  #9  
Old 03-27-2012, 01:07 PM
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Red_OX Red_OX is offline
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Smile

If you set it to "source" and there is no output its not a head problem........
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  #10  
Old 03-27-2012, 02:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tapetech View Post
If the meters are working in play as you say, then you may have a muting problem. Remove muting transistor Q109 and see if that restores play output.

Heads look good.
I think I do have a muting problem. I changed the lamps in the meters and I think that is when it started. They were all burnt out. I put in 8v 250mA had no sound in any of the channels. Then I replaced the lamps with 8v 100mA and now I have 3 and 4 that work. I really hate to keep pulling these lamps. It is a PITA. What lamp can I replace these with to get rid of the muting problem if that is what is is? Can I run a resistor on the 8v 100mA lamp to lower the voltage draw? It calls for 7v lamps.

Can you tell me where or what board the Q109 transistor is located?
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Old 03-27-2012, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daveyh View Post
I think I do have a muting problem. I changed the lamps in the meters and I think that is when it started. They were all burnt out. I put in 8v 250mA had no sound in any of the channels. Then I replaced the lamps with 8v 100mA and now I have 3 and 4 that work. I really hate to keep pulling these lamps. It is a PITA. What lamp can I replace these with to get rid of the muting problem if that is what is is? Can I run a resistor on the 8v 100mA lamp to lower the voltage draw? It calls for 7v lamps.

Can you tell me where or what board the Q109 transistor is located?
To de-power all VU lamps, remove wire from pin 13 on the power supply board. It's the 7 volt feed. See if channels then come back.

I think Q109 is on the plug-in R/P board.
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Old 03-27-2012, 02:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tapetech View Post
To de-power all VU lamps, removed the wire from pin 13 on the power supply board. It's the 7 volt feed. See if channels then come back.

I think Q109 is on the plug-in R/P board.
WOW! You have no idea how you have made my day. It worked. That did it. I removed the wire from pin 13 on the power supply board and all channels work! It's fantastic.

Now I need to know how to fix this and get the correct voltage on the lamps. I have searched the net to try to find 7V lamps but could not find any. I am in the US. Any ideas?

Thanks so much!!!!

Last edited by daveyh; 03-27-2012 at 02:42 PM.
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Old 03-27-2012, 03:43 PM
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Great to hear this is up and rolling, great deck, a beast, one of my favorite units.
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Old 03-27-2012, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by krisjay View Post
Great to hear this is up and rolling, great deck, a beast, one of my favorite units.
Thanks. Not up and running all the way yet. Still need to find the correct lamps to install. I have worked on this trying to find the problem off and on for two weeks! Thanks to Tepetech and the others on this forum I can sleep a little longer at nights without wondering what I did wrong and how to fix it. I guess I could run it without the lamps but I really like the lights.
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Old 03-27-2012, 05:35 PM
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I'll look at the schematic and see if a mod will make it work with those lamps.

Or you could just remove the mute transistors.
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Old 03-27-2012, 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by tapetech View Post
I'll look at the schematic and see if a mod will make it work with those lamps.

Or you could just remove the mute transistors.
That would be great.
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  #17  
Old 03-27-2012, 07:27 PM
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Hello daveyh,

People are always in the rush to put a part in without checking the specs or talking to the right person.
http://studiosoundelectronics.com/8track.htm#LAMP

In the above site where lamps are sold the L-19 lamp is the one I have used. It is the correct voltage and current value to use in the meters.
Of course I would have said that two lamp changes ago.
Using fuse of pigtail lamps just because you are wanting to stay with a certain lamp configuration is not the answer and as you can tell the deck does not care what they look like it only cares about the current and voltage values.
__________________
Best regards,

Sam Palermo, BSEE, past Broadcast Engineer
Skywave Tape Deck Repair- Chicago area
(630)616-0932 Office/ 708-334-2260 Cell, E mail:skywavebe@sbcglobal.net
Past Teac/Tascam Lead Service Technician at Chicago Factory Service still doing repairs.
http://www.thumbtack.com/il/bensenvi...tascam-repairs
Need Tape? http://www.splicit.com/index.html, The BEST SM are from Stereomanuals.com!
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Old 03-28-2012, 05:04 AM
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daveyh daveyh is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skywavebe View Post
Hello daveyh,

People are always in the rush to put a part in without checking the specs or talking to the right person.
http://studiosoundelectronics.com/8track.htm#LAMP

In the above site where lamps are sold the L-19 lamp is the one I have used. It is the correct voltage and current value to use in the meters.
Of course I would have said that two lamp changes ago.
Using fuse of pigtail lamps just because you are wanting to stay with a certain lamp configuration is not the answer and as you can tell the deck does not care what they look like it only cares about the current and voltage values.
I did check with some other people on other forums and through emails who gave me other advice on the lamps. In fact, a guy who works on reel to reels and wrote a paper on the workings of this model even suggested a 12v 40mA as my next attempt since the 7v lamps were unavailable. It seemed like no one really had changed the lamps in this model or they just purchased a new meter or left them as is because it was so hard to disassemble the unit to get to them. I have replace many lamps in other TEAC equipment using 8v lamps and never had a problem. Of course I did not know of the channel MUTING on this model until recently. So I was shooting in the dark.

The lamps you suggested above. How did you make them fit? Have you actually replaced the lamps in this model before with these lamps and if so, does the lamp light dissipate evenly throughout the whole meter?
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Old 03-28-2012, 07:34 AM
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I've used the L-24 lamp (8V, 100ma) in many Teacs and other decks without problems. The smaller L-19 type lamps won't give as-even illumination. The 3440 is a bit unique by not working properly with the L-24.
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Old 03-28-2012, 07:55 AM
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Hello daveyh,

Unlike some peoples advice on other sites where I have seen a lot of bad advice, in my case you are not dealing with an beginner. Perhaps you do not know my history so I will just let you know that I am a past Teac Technician out of the Chicago Factory Service Facility in Arlington Heights IL. I have been doing repairs for about 40 years.
I have replaced hundreds of meter lamps in cassette to open reel and even some processors and mixers. When you come down to it, all these devices use a very like meter assembly. There were difference in lamps types in them that went from Fuse type, then Pigtail to now a small source lamp like the L19. All these lamps emit light from a filament that is not all that long. So in working with what we can get these days, and lamps are on the decline and may not even be around at all in 10 years, we have to work with what is available and with what works. I have often seen fuse lamps for cars purchased for tape deck meters. They usually are 12 V but they use 1/4 A and that is far outside the design of the fixture rating both in heat and current supply rating so the correct way to put in a lamp is to position one so that it is not visible to the eye from the outside, is not touching the movement spring or jewel parts and is high enough to supply the face with illumination. The other factors are voltage and current considerations. The voltage supplied is generally a 6.3 Vac from a circuit section or in some cases a transformer section. The current draw for two lamps as originally installed was less than 250mA. If you exceed this amount the deck will complain or in your case refuse to work in some way. I do remember muting being a problem when the wrong lamp is used but so far this is the second time I have had to deal with it and all these cases was not from my doing. The use of a 8 V lamp in a 6.3 volt supply makes the lamp last very long and also make the meter face glow rather that stick out at you. Yes, I have used the L19 and even some of the other pigtail lamps L-24 that are out of stock. I wonder how that happened? I have replaced lamps in most units that Teac made and it is often a case where you do have to take off all the knobs and front panel as no easy way was designed into the unit from a service standpoint. That is why the idea of replacing the lamps at the same time with new one keeps them uniform is brightness and the same age. I can tell you that on more than one occasion I put everything back and then another lamp would go out due to the mechanical vibration of working on an adjacent meter- it is wise to change them all at the same time. LED's have also been a source of discussion and I am sure it is possible to retrofit them but I have not finished my research on doing that yet. They use LED's in Ramsa and
Crest $10,000 mixing boards so they are possible. I have not seen them burn out yet. I hope this helps.
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Best regards,

Sam Palermo, BSEE, past Broadcast Engineer
Skywave Tape Deck Repair- Chicago area
(630)616-0932 Office/ 708-334-2260 Cell, E mail:skywavebe@sbcglobal.net
Past Teac/Tascam Lead Service Technician at Chicago Factory Service still doing repairs.
http://www.thumbtack.com/il/bensenvi...tascam-repairs
Need Tape? http://www.splicit.com/index.html, The BEST SM are from Stereomanuals.com!
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