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  #21  
Old 07-16-2017, 01:57 PM
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Lance Lawson Lance Lawson is offline
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Very recently I compared a close mic electric guitar with a direct line in. Precious little difference. Al ambiance has to be added electronically. No chance of the real thing which we're loosing more of every day.
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  #22  
Old 07-16-2017, 03:46 PM
nandit0 nandit0 is offline
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I wish I had that one

as others have said, minimalistic miking, pre transistor electronics and an all analog signal path, and on top of that a couple of persons deeply caring about the process and voilá, one of the best recordings ever made

Of course, i dont have that one but do have some others "living presence" lps

Of course, Reiner´s Sherezade is highly praised

I think the music itself contributes to the experience. I have 2 Sherezade Lps and I love both. Let us not forget that the composer was an instrumentation profesor and it shows on this music. Delighful to listen to and perfect for this hobby

My "sherezades": DG Seigi Ozawa and the Boston Philarmonic from early 70´s

and Classic Records Pavel Kogan with the Moscow State Symphony Orchestra from 2002

Both lps are wonderful and AFAIK both are all analog

Last edited by nandit0; 07-16-2017 at 03:55 PM.
  #23  
Old 07-16-2017, 05:33 PM
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Phonatacid Phonatacid is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lance Lawson View Post
Very recently I compared a close mic electric guitar with a direct line in. Precious little difference. Al ambiance has to be added electronically. No chance of the real thing which we're loosing more of every day.
Little difference? Your results are interesting. I can hear HUGE differences between a mic'ed electric guitar vs. going direct. We're getting closer at getting the same sound by going direct every day, but the algorithms just aren't quite there yet to match what's going on with the tubes. There's a lot of analog chaos and harmonic distortions going on that just can't seem to be replicated just yet by software. Virtually all guitar is still recording by close miking a good amp for this reason.

Now bass on the other hand is different. Going direct almost always results in a much clearer, punchier tone. Sometimes blended in with a mic'ed amp gives a bit more color though.
  #24  
Old 07-17-2017, 04:53 AM
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absinthe_boy absinthe_boy is offline
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Sorry but I can hear close miking a mile off. It's ruining record production and has been for about 25 years.

As various veteran recording engineers and producers have said....we just don't make records that sound any good any more.

Find a skilled recording engineer, tape op and producer....get some musicians who actually know how to play together..and let them do so. Maybe put a baffle between the drums and the rest...because drums are loud.

Have you sat next to someone drumming? You feel it as much as hear it...through your entire body. That *can* be captured my mics and laid down on tape or even in ones and zeros. But you won't achieve it by close miking everything.

And who the phrack ever thought of close miking symphony orchestras? That misses the ENTIRE point of how symphony orchestras are put together, different instrument sections placed where they are and so on.

Aaargh. Maybe I should actually properly train as a recording engineer. Taught myself a lot from books written in the 60s and 70s, learned from a few musicians and more recently confirmed many of my beliefs (and changed a couple) by conversing online with famous record producers.
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  #25  
Old 07-17-2017, 06:06 AM
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Ghitulescu Ghitulescu is online now
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The orchestra is laid so it is because it was an acoustic "instrument".

Closed miking is used generally with solists, yet there are engineers that think they can recreate the spatial sensation in mixing - and I don't blame them, it is possible to place an instrument wherever one wants, in ProTools, so why bother with placing mikes and stuff? - mic the instruments, then place them in space wherever one wants, and bingo...

The same approach, mutatis mutandis, is used everywhere - from car designing to computer simulations.
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  #26  
Old 07-17-2017, 07:40 AM
CaryAudio CaryAudio is offline
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Digital, it's gonna be big someday.......

As soon as someone figures out how to use it properly......LOL
  #27  
Old 07-18-2017, 01:41 AM
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absinthe_boy absinthe_boy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghitulescu View Post
The orchestra is laid so it is because it was an acoustic "instrument".

Closed miking is used generally with solists, yet there are engineers that think they can recreate the spatial sensation in mixing - and I don't blame them, it is possible to place an instrument wherever one wants, in ProTools, so why bother with placing mikes and stuff? - mic the instruments, then place them in space wherever one wants, and bingo...

The same approach, mutatis mutandis, is used everywhere - from car designing to computer simulations.
Well...it doesn't work with an orchestra. Decca got it right back in the 50s.

You simply don't want the individual detail of each horse-hair bowing a string, or each valve being depressed....not with a full orchestra. That's not how it was designed to be experienced.

Taking the lazy approach and saying to oneself "Oh I can move the instruments wherever I want in Pro Tools" is part of why so many modern recordings across all genres sound......shit.
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  #28  
Old 07-18-2017, 05:48 AM
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Naughty I have said this before,

Quote:
Originally Posted by tapetech View Post
This spectrogragh of TakeFive (CD version) shows that you don't need flat response to 20K for a great-sounding recording. It shows pretty much nothing beyond 15K.
Yes the sound of 90% of the recordings I have heard stops about 15 kHz tapetech. I have tried to get folks to understand that but to no avail.
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  #29  
Old 07-18-2017, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johns82 View Post
Yes the sound of 90% of the recordings I have heard stops about 15 kHz tapetech. I have tried to get folks to understand that but to no avail.
Thank you tapetech and John for your posts!
A good recording is more than just frequency response up to 20k!
And its also the reason why you do not need to take a hearingtest before you buy a good tapedeck (like in another thread suggested).
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  #30  
Old Yesterday, 05:10 PM
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Lance Lawson Lance Lawson is offline
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Close micing as with most pursuits in recording is designed to capture as true and pure sound of a given instrument. Back in the 30's, 40's and 50's there was precious little in the way of added ambient sound. Small spring and plate reverb didn't happen until the early 50' so engineers and producers relied on the sound of the room.
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Last edited by Lance Lawson; Yesterday at 05:21 PM.
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