problem. with technics rs-b85.

[mark902]

hi. it sounds pretty great. relatively great. but when i make a recording. and i flip from source to tape. the peaks on the source might be like 6. and the tape will peak at like 4. or so. it's not a terrible drop. but it's noticeable. what would this be caused by?

[Scorpion8]

Dirty head, or misaligned/calibrated electrically in PB level compared to REC level. Or if you're using a cheap Type I, the tape may not be able to hold that level that you're driving it to.

[Tape Rat]

Unless the heads are are worn or need cleaning and the all the setting set are up the only time I come across this problem is if I am using lovely old smooth sounding BASF Chrome tapes, the output level was never has high as Japanese type IIs*reelspin*

[mark902]

how do you tell if heads are worn anyway? like by looking at them. what would i look for? or is there anything to look for? or is it all listening?

the highs are what i always listen to. pretty much. and they sound pretty nice and clean. to me. i mean, i don't have a trained ear or anything. but i did return a pair of speakers once because of a click when the bass went on one of them. a click that nobody, it seemed, could hear. so i wouldn't say that i'm completely, sound... unobservant? i'd say i'm pretty fussy. i was never able to feel comfortable recording from another cassette. i never did like auto reverse on my walkmen, they would sound all crazy after they flipped. see i can sense crazy but i'm not educated in the terms of what crazy actually means. wow and flutter?

it happens with all tapes. whatever type. it just sounds lower. buy a tit lil bit. but they still sound great. the ony difference i can notice is the volume difference.

[Tape Rat]

Well all you can do is clean the heads again make sure that the setting are right (have you experimented with the bias control while monitoring) turn of the noise reduction system DBX Dolby ect use a good quality type II Jap tape and see what happens,if the meters are lower but level with each other (L=R) then I wouldn't worry about head wear you could also demag the heads as well but remember the machines age and how long it's been sitting there doing nothing sometimes machines start coming back up to speck the more they are used.*reelspin*

[Scorpion8]

how do you tell if heads are worn anyway? like by looking at them. what would i look for? or is there anything to look for? or is it all listening?

Normally on a decent sized head you would run your thumbnail across it and feel for a groove or worn-spot cut into the head from the tape path. If the head is nicely rounded, shiny after cleaning (have you demagged?) and has no groove able to catch a thumbnail it's probably not worn enough.

it happens with all tapes. whatever type. it just sounds lower. buy a tit lil bit. but they still sound great. the ony difference i can notice is the volume difference.

There may be a failing component in the signal path or the PB level could be mis-adjusted compared to the REC level.

[mark902]

ok. i think the heads seem ok? i used the end of a straw. instead of my nail. but i didn't feel any catches or anything. there is this lil spot of ? on the playback head. here are some pics.

http://i812.photobucket.com/albums/zz46/mark902/IMGP0830-1.jpg

http://i812.photobucket.com/albums/zz46/mark902/IMGP0831.jpg

http://i812.photobucket.com/albums/zz46/mark902/IMGP0834.jpg

http://i812.photobucket.com/albums/zz46/mark902/IMGP0830.jpg

ok. i had to take a few. i tried to get some different angles with better lighting and all. but. here were the clearest. you can see that spot of garbage on the playback head. i don't know if it's in an area that would make a difference. i'm thinking that if it were on that black part it would be more of a disaster.

but how do they look?

i'm hopeing that the more i use it the better it will sound. and a demagnetizer is next on my list. i've never. i've read lots of guides though.

[Scorpion8]

Those look fine. If you've cleaned them repeatedly with 99% isopropyl alcohol and the spot remains, then it may just be "in" the head material and inconsequential at the spot that it appears to be.

[mark902]

i've cleaned them again and again. i don't know what that spot is. i thought it was crud. and then i thought maybe it was a gouge out of the head. but i can't feel any unevenness.

it's really strange to me. cus now that i have that other amp going, with it's two tape deck capabilities, i can play both tape decks at the same time and switch back and forth. the sony is definitely louder, but i think the pitch is a bit off. but the technics sounds a lot clearer. but the heads on the sony look way better than the heads on the technics.

i should switch the decks around, just to rule out the amp. i spose.

it's all fun and exciting. but it makes me a bit nuts when things don't work properly. i just want the most from my six dollar and ninty nine cent rs-b85.

i've generated some test tones useing audacity. and put them on my ipod. 400hz, 1000, 3000, and 15000. they sound a bit terrible on both decks. i think both decks need to be aligned. both have stronger right signals. but only the technics has the low volume thing.

i wish i could download information directly to my brain. i don't know anything. but i'm thinking about getting out me screwdriver and practicing my alignment skills on the technics. um, developing, my alignment skills. it seems simpler than the sony.

am i biting off more than i can chew?

[Scorpion8]

Alignment of the heads on the Technics deck is not that difficult, although it takes several specialized tools. I would be cautious, because there's no simple explanation of "why" they would have gotten out of alignment.

[mark902]

thank you so much for all your helpful answers and suggestions scorpion8 and general interest in my probably mind numbingly dull questions. i'm quite a beginner in these advanced... fun times.

but it turns out that there is an output volume dial. on the rs-b85. and, well, it seems that it controls the um, output, volume. huh. what do you think of that? what did they think of next? i thought it was just for the headphones. i think that's a strange idea. i don't like having volume controls on top of volume controls. headphones with volume controls. no. plugging my ipod through the headphone jack. no. listening to music on a computer. no. i hate it. volume here and volume there. i hate it.

but at least i know why the volume was so low compared to the sony. it still doesn't explain the tape/source difference. unless that is just the nature of cassettes. i feel like sometimes i notice it more than other times. and even notice it on the sony now.

they both still need a good servicing. i think. but it seems less dire now. i'll be able to sleep tonight at least.

[SaSi_Sidi]

I'l try to explain the playback level issue you describe.

Take a brand new high quality cassette deck in known perfect condition.

Put in a cassette, select the tape type and adjust recording level. Record.

Then repeat the same with a different cassette formula.

Then playback both cassettes on the same deck. You might notice that one cassette has lower level than other. Or perhaps higher. And you might also notice that one cassette has attenuated high frequencies.

Each cassette tape is a different formula and requires fine adjustments to perform at it's capabilities (i.e. produce the same output level and as much high frequencies as possible).

To properly adjust a deck to a tape you need to have fine bias and fine level adjustments. Many TOTL decks offer these and some later TOTL decks also offered automatic tape adjustment. Insert a cassette, press a button, wait a few moments and the deck is adjusted for that particular batch of that particular cassette tape formula.

In the earlier cassette decks and R2R decks, one would have the deck adjusted for a specific tape that they prefered/could get/could afford and then use that tape exclusively.

Regarding azimuth adjustment, it can be done, it needs some tools but you can get them in s/w version but mainly it requires an understanding of what you are doing.

It's interesting that there's no such thread already stickied here.

[mark902]

thanks sasi. i didn't realize that the seperate, little rec level knob was for exactly that problem. i thought it would just make the source louder like the big rec level knob and i thought that was a less than ideal solution to this problem. too bad there is no such knob on the technics and only the sony. except there probably is such a knob on the technics but i can't see it, or something, past my own... knobness.

thanks to everyone. now i just have to demagnetize and get aligned and then i'll be set. i think.