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View Full Version : My new Benz Glider - thoughts and pictures...


Mr. Lin
10-01-2008, 03:38 PM
Since many of you are from AK you might have seen this in the AK turntable forum last night. I had a lot to say, so obviously the best way is to simply post the exact same thing here, so here it is:

It's amazing what's in those grooves.

A cartridge upgrade to this price class has been a long time coming for me. Along the way I've spent quite a bit on lots of little things, only buying a Grado Platinum out of curiosity, but putting on hold my plans to own a low-output MC cartridge.

Well, I'm sort of there. I'd normally never consider buying a used cartridge, especially a MC cartridge, but my experience on A-gon has been so positive that I decided to trust someone selling a Glider that's supposed to have less than 100 hours and 2 months use on it. Having received and examined it, I'm confident that he was honest with me as the cartridge appears immaculate. Then there's the sound, but I'll get to that in a minute. Grab a drink because this might take a while.

The conundrum I faced once I decided it was time to try a low-output cartridge had to do with my phono preamp, my beloved Wright 200C tube phono preamp, specifically, which is a wonderful performer but strangely stuck at 47kohms despite the adjustable gain from 40db to 60db. So I contacted George Wright and asked his opinion. Always quick to help a past customer, George informed me that a low-output cartridge would certainly work with the 200C, but without a step up transformer it's likely I'd be losing something, and that's just not acceptable to me. As for the impedance, he could offer no definitive answer, it's a gamble with MC cartridges.

So I canned the whole thing. Finally, now that summer was over and I'd indulged in just about every other audio hi-fi toy I could get my hands on, the time seemed right to go for something special. I spent many nights searching and came across the Glider on A-gon at much less than retail, in seemingly-new condition. Most importantly, this is the M2, meaning medium output of .8mV, which George Wright recommended if I were to buy any MC cartridge. After talking back and forth with the seller, a deal was made, and then it was time for the waiting game.

It arrived a few days ago. I eagerly removed all the packaging and lifted the lid off the case, and I was struck by how tiny the Glider is in real life, at least after years of looking at pictures of it on the internet. This made me a little nervous, it appeared even more fragile than I'd originally anticipated.

So Sunday evening I decided to just get the unpleasant part out of the way. It's not that I don't enjoy installing cartridges, but when we're talking about something this delicate and expensive, well, I don't like installing cartridges. And boy, did I sweat! There was even a close call when one of the screws snapped up against the cartridge body, which caused me to let out a primordial yelp. My girlfriend must have thought I'd shocked myself or something. I couldn't believe Benz wouldn't supply non-magnetic screws with their cartridge, and it turns out they didn't, the seller accidentally included the wrong ones, for which he was very apologetic.

Anyway, after an hour or so of heart-stopping close calls the deed was done. I put on Psychedelic Furs Mirror Moves for a quick test; it was 11:00PM so I had to keep the volume low. Immediately my girlfriend noted how much "clearer" it sounded, but if an $800 moving coil cartridge doesn't have excellent resolution, well, that would be sad. At low volume I could already hear some things I liked, little things, details, textures. Roll your eyes, but you're going to see the word texture at least twice more before this is finished.

Yesterday I had a couple of hours to sit down and hear what the Glider is made of. There was a problem right away. I don't know if it's because of the design of this cartridge, or something else, but there's now quite audible hum and what I believe might be RFI noise when no music is playing. This caused a brief relapse to last nights uncomfortable state of hypertension, but as I began to listen to music I quickly forgot about it, and though the problem persists as I type this, it's surprisingly unnoticeable.

If I trip over my tongue here or use those tired, hackneyed terms we're all so sick of reading and having to repeat, I'm sorry. But I'm not trying to get published, I'm trying to tell you all what I'm hearing, to the best of my ability.

I had prepared myself not to be blown away, because expensive cartridges are notoriously subject to the laws of diminishing returns. I expected to have to listen closely for the important improvements. To a certain degree, this is what happened. I wasn't blown away, but rather gently pulled into a more liquid, textured (told you) sound than I've ever experienced. The music was the same, yet there was so much more to it.

The first record played was The Sound Heads and Hearts, featuring the late Adrian Borland as lead singer. I heard all the things I expected: good resolution, powerful bass, clear and extended high frequencies, and lots and lots of detail. It was the presentation of the detail that got to me, however, when I listened closely to the vocals and noticed just the slightest bit of reverb I'd never heard before in years of listening to and loving this song. Additionally, I felt like I could hear the space around Borland in the studio. These two things had the effect of dramatically increasing the emotional impact of an already intense song. The emotion in his voice was clearer than I thought possible from an audio system, and a studio recording suddenly sounded like it was being performed live. Not right in my room, mind you, I'm hardly that far up the chain at this point, my point is that I felt, like never before, how much of a performance Borland was putting on as the song was recorded.

Next up was Pinback Blue Screen Life. This is a good record for testing how well a cartridge (or the entire system for that matter) handles dynamics. Of course the strong dynamics were there, with all the punch, but more importantly the Glider presented all the instruments so realistically that parts of some songs actually sounded quite different than what I was used to. This was particularly the case with percussion instruments; it's apparent that the bass drum was stuffed with towels, and the sort of muffled thump this made brought me back to the days when I played the drums. There was also quite a bit of definition around plucked guitar strings. My Dynavector 10X5 does this well also, but the Glider put some "air" around them, which made the notes feel more present, if you know what I mean. See? This isn't easy.

What did knock my socks off was the first jazz record I put on, which was Charles Mingus Mingus Ah Um. Imaging was fantastic, soundstage was spread out, all that good stuff. Now brace yourself, I'm going to use the word texture again. I'm sorry. Brass instruments sound absolutely amazing with the Glider, it's as if you can see the sound, and the texture of the instrument was strikingly realistic. It gave me a new appreciation for the trumpet, especially when I moved on to Miles Davis. At this very moment I'm listening to Miles Smiles, and never before have I so enjoyed the busy, yet smooth, notes played by Davis, and never before has my attention been so strongly drawn to the sound of the instrument.

And this is what the Glider does so nicely, it gives life to the instrument, thereby pulling you into the music, and the notes, without having to concentrate hard as you try to keep up with everything that's going on - because who wants to do that? A similar thing occurred while listening to Radiohead OK Computer, one of the new pressings that just arrived a couple days ago (always be prepared!). On the song "Let Down," which is one of my favorites on the album, the layered guitars swirled and flowed beautifully, as if the notes were being poured into the music - liquid, is the term people often use for this, I think.

That's much of what I've heard so far. I'm very happy. I wasn't jumping up and down with glee the first time I listened to the Glider, I wasn't utterly shocked at what is possible with vinyl and a great cartridge, there was little I didn't anticipate in one way or another. That said, the Glider lives up to all my expectations and I would call it a great cartridge without any hesitation, regardless of what I have and have not heard. There's no two ways about it, the Dynavector 10X5 is out-classed in just about every category by the Benz, but is anyone surprised to hear that? At the same time, I would point out to you that I still believe the 10X5 to be a great performer, and it can hold its own against something like the Glider, but it just doesn't have the inner and outer detail, enormous bass, incredible dynamics, and liquid sound (be thankful I didn't mention texture again, OK?) that the Glider does.

The short time I've spent listening to the Glider M2 has been a learning experience for me. All the little details, just waiting to be heard, sitting in the grooves, are like a lesson in connecting yourself to the artist as much as possible, and experiencing the music in as many or as few ways as you'd like.

Pictures below, and by the way, it was a serious pain in the neck to get decent pictures of this thing. I must have taken about 25 before I got one that wasn't blurry. Thanks for reading. By all means comment away!

Dave

Scorpion8
10-01-2008, 03:52 PM
Two words: Am jealous. Or: You suck :D. Or: Your address? or:.....

Scorpion8
10-01-2008, 03:53 PM
Got that off my chest, now I can tell you I'm glad and happy for you and jealous all at the same time. I've had a high-output MC on my want-list for quite some time. Someday ....

Fast Forward
10-01-2008, 07:58 PM
Got that off my chest, now I can tell you I'm glad and happy for you and jealous all at the same time. I've had a high-output MC on my want-list for quite some time. Someday ....congrats,, have one on my wish list

gamve
10-02-2008, 02:14 AM
Great review dave. Glad your happy with our purchase. A well setup moving coil sound is a joy. Check your cables re the hum. Loose RCA's and poorly shielded cables with such minute signals can drive you mad (eventually).
Those nude style cartridges scare the crap out of me, I have a nuded denon and that cantilever sticking out so far troubles me....be careful and lock the cat out
Cheers
G

close652
10-02-2008, 03:12 AM
Great writing indeed -- congratulations for the new Benz!
It looks like many happy listening hours coming for you.

Could you describe your amp, loudspeakers, cables, etc.?

Mr. Lin
10-02-2008, 08:16 PM
Great writing indeed -- congratulations for the new Benz!
It looks like many happy listening hours coming for you.

Could you describe your amp, loudspeakers, cables, etc.?

Yes I can.

My amplifier is an Audcom hybrid integrated amplifier. It has a single 6922 tube in the preamp section, but the actual amplification solid state, 80wpc max. I also bought this used on A-gon, the brand is relatively obscure, it was a small Canadian company that I don't think exists anymore. It's actually a great performer, I'm happy with the sound, but the hybrid thing is a tease, and it has me wanting to go all-tube more than ever.

I had Eric Alexander of Tekton Design specially design and build a pair of speakers for me that are made of bubinga wood (hadn't heard of it before he showed me pictures) and use 8" Fostex full-range drivers. I did this because I have some SET tube monoblock kits that I've yet to build, but once I do I'll need the efficient Tekton speakers because the monoblocks are only 3.5wpc. My speakers are the strongest link in my system, they are absolutely stunning and sound unlike any other kind of speaker I've ever heard. They have so much detail realism that I actually found it kind of eerie when I first got them. Also, they are extremely revealing, which is usually a good thing, but sometimes it's a very bad thing. :D I attached a couple pictures below, but keep in mind these are from January, when I first got the Tekton speakers, so I was using a Outlaw 2150 receiver and various other things that I'm not using anymore, which you'll see in the pictures.

Cables, well, I change those around a lot. From turntable to phono preamp I use the best I have, Tara Labs Air 1 Series 2, which I also bought used on A-gon (I make out like a bandit on that site!). From phono preamp to amp I've switched over to Grover SC cables where I had been using Anti Cable interconnects, which are unshielded. This reduced the hum a little bit. I also use interconnects from Kimber, XLO, and Audioquest. My speaker wire is Anti Cable speaker wire, bare ended, pretty cheap, and made such a difference in transparency that even I was surprised.

There's more, but that's pretty much what's involved with the Pro-Ject/Glider combination.

Gamve: At this point I believe I've narrowed the hum and noise issue down to my tube phono preamp. This is the first time I've ever had the gain turned all the way up to 60db, and others have told me that this often makes noise and hum that was already there (which it was, but not as bad) even more noticeable. I think it's worth putting up with to use my Wright 200C phono stage, because I consider that one of the most important parts of my system at the moment.

And yes, the exposed cantilever makes me very nervous. No animals are allowed in my room. That's why installing the Glider was so unpleasant, I was very scared I'd slip, just a little, and it would be over before it even began. Unfortunately I'm going to have to go through that again soon because the seller sent me the correct screws yesterday, and I think it would be better to use those. Note, however, that I'm not using magnetic screws with the Glider, that would be very bad.

Mr. Lin
10-02-2008, 08:19 PM
Got that off my chest, now I can tell you I'm glad and happy for you and jealous all at the same time. I've had a high-output MC on my want-list for quite some time. Someday ....

I know the feeling, believe me. I consider myself very, very fortunate to be able to own and hear something like this.

Naknut
10-03-2008, 08:28 AM
Enjoyed the review very much. I don't think I would even dare try to install a $800 cartridge. Too scary!
Thanks for sharing.

Doug_Olitsky
10-03-2008, 02:27 PM
Did you see the Tekton speakers and amps a few years back at the VTV auido show in Edison.

I liked his set amps and enjoyed watching hot swapping tubes.


Your quest reminds me of my process of choosing a Denon 103r and building a Lundhal SUT to feed my Monolithic Sound Phono Pre, which is riding on my Empire 598II

Congrats and enjoy *Hi5*

Mr. Lin
10-03-2008, 05:19 PM
Did you see the Tekton speakers and amps a few years back at the VTV auido show in Edison.

I liked his set amps and enjoyed watching hot swapping tubes.


Your quest reminds me of my process of choosing a Denon 103r and building a Lundhal SUT to feed my Monolithic Sound Phono Pre, which is riding on my Empire 598II

Congrats and enjoy *Hi5*

Doug,
Was this in Edison, NJ? To be honest with you, a few years ago were what I would call the Dark Ages of audio for me. Same love of music, plastic turntable. *headache* I've come a long way.

Rat44
10-03-2008, 05:23 PM
That looks like a Nice setup.
Good tables seem to be unforgiving of bad setups.
Good luck getting it dialed in.

Mr. Lin
10-03-2008, 06:58 PM
That looks like a Nice setup.
Good tables seem to be unforgiving of bad setups.
Good luck getting it dialed in.

Thanks, I think I have a ways to go still. The digital scale will be a big step forward, then I'm going to start playing with the VTA some more. More than the turntable it's my speakers that are very, very unforgiving. They present everything, whether you want to hear it or not.

gamve
10-03-2008, 08:30 PM
Gamve: At this point I believe I've narrowed the hum and noise issue down to my tube phono preamp. This is the first time I've ever had the gain turned all the way up to 60db, and others have told me that this often makes noise and hum that was already there (which it was, but not as bad) even more noticeable. I think it's worth putting up with to use my Wright 200C phono stage, because I consider that one of the most important parts of my system at the moment.

Dave, what tubes are in your Stepup. If I guess right and they are 12AX7's You could try say some lower gain vairiants with triple mica constuction and low microphonics. 5751's shit on 12AX7's in every respect and the are a direct plug in replacement. The 5751 has a gain factor of 75 compared with the 12AXy's factor of 100 but to be honest you would be lucky to pick the given gain differeance. Sylvania gold brand black or grey plates are great if you can stretch to ther prices asked otherwise triple mica RCA are OK as well.

Mr. Lin
10-05-2008, 04:41 PM
Gamve: At this point I believe I've narrowed the hum and noise issue down to my tube phono preamp. This is the first time I've ever had the gain turned all the way up to 60db, and others have told me that this often makes noise and hum that was already there (which it was, but not as bad) even more noticeable. I think it's worth putting up with to use my Wright 200C phono stage, because I consider that one of the most important parts of my system at the moment.

Dave, what tubes are in your Stepup. If I guess right and they are 12AX7's You could try say some lower gain vairiants with triple mica constuction and low microphonics. 5751's shit on 12AX7's in every respect and the are a direct plug in replacement. The 5751 has a gain factor of 75 compared with the 12AXy's factor of 100 but to be honest you would be lucky to pick the given gain differeance. Sylvania gold brand black or grey plates are great if you can stretch to ther prices asked otherwise triple mica RCA are OK as well.

Gamve, I actually have a NOS GE 5751. It seemed OK when I tried it a while back, but I was told by several people on AK that it would mess with the RIAA equalization in a phono stage. That particular tube does have a very good reputation though.

The tube complement on the 200C is as follows:

Power supply (separate chassis):
One 6EA7
One 6X4 (rectification)

Phono stage:
Two 12AU7
Two 12AX7

I've tried a whole bunch of different tubes all around, including 5963, 5814, and like I said the 5751. They all have their ups and downs.